Your Innovation Podcast. This is the third episode of the Driving Eureka! Podcast. The science of Innovation success: Impact of Environment; charts vs. words; and how many sales attempts. Subscribe to learn how to Find Filter and Fast Track Big Ideas.
The Driving Eureka! Podcast – The Science of Innovation Success
Impact of Environment
Charts vs. Words
Make 3 Attempts to Make Sales
Tripp: [00:00:00] This is part five of The Science of Innovation Success series we’ll discuss impact of environment charts versus words and how many sales attempts.
Tripp: [00:00:14] The Driving Eureka! podcast with Doug Hall and Tripp Babbitt is sponsored by the Eureka! Ranch the ranch specializes in helping companies find filter and fast track big ideas.
Tripp: [00:00:28] All right this is episode thirty eighth in our science of innovation success series. And this week our three topics are impact of environment charts versus words and how many sales attempts. And I’m noticing a trend here Doug as we’ve gotten deeper into this series the more cryptic are your three categories better at hiding them.
Doug: [00:00:55] So we’re just having some fun.
Doug: [00:00:57] All right. So impact of environment.
Doug: [00:00:59] Ok so research finds that customers are three times more likely to purchase when they like the environment. So so the environment whether it’s in your store whether it’s the environment of being with you hanging out whatever it might be. University of British Columbia students were shown advertisements for products in one case they were played music that appealed to them. While the while they were looking at the ads in other cases they found annoying music and the professors have to do studies and they’ll play different music and they’ll ask them how much they like it or how annoying it is. And I’m not throwing people under the bus here. But Indian classical music was found to be the most annoying music that they could play in India.
Doug: [00:01:50] They’re not getting it you know. So they did the viewing. They were then asked if they’d be likely to buy a small thing like a pan or you know they’ll have a couple of different things and three times more but when they were in the environment where they liked the music they’re not.
Doug: [00:02:06] So as Ben Franklin said if you would be loved love and be lovable. When you’re making your pitch make the environment friendly and as likable as possible.
Doug: [00:02:18] You know I mean we just have to you know and I’ve seen this in a number of different studies. Tripp I’ve seen this in a number of different places where likeability you know somebody’s playing like this. You know the other products are wonderful it’s nice. I just don’t like them. Mm hmm. Likability is a big thing and you know when you get into all of this power and intimidation I’ll look at stuff and I’m not sure not sure.
Tripp: [00:02:47] Have you done a any studies. There’s a book Bob saltiness or Robert Cialdini pre suasion and and I think one of the things that he covers off in there is smells can smell is it.
Tripp: [00:03:00] It’s kind of funny. Your eyes when you see something and it kind of fills in the blanks. It’s kind of scary actually because there’s multiple parts of your brain that go into sight but but smell goes right to your basically goes right to your brain. There’s a spot that it goes and so there’s people there have been these studies like lavender supposedly is something that makes people have you run across any of that.
Doug: [00:03:25] I’m not I’m not I’ve not gotten into that kind of stuff.
Tripp: [00:03:29] Okay. Cause you pretty daily mostly and not exclusively but mostly with product services.
Doug: [00:03:36] Yeah. OK we’ll do both and there are some sense and there are some things on that but. But you know. And there is some literature on some of this stuff but it’s just not been an area that I’ve looked at.
Tripp: [00:03:48] Ok cool. All right and the second thing is charts versus words.
Doug: [00:03:55] So when presenting data to your customer you’ll be most effective if a you provide a clear and simple chart or b you explain the data in clear and simple words. Do you think.
Tripp: [00:04:09] I would think I’ve seeing. I’m very visual so I would say the simple chart.
Doug: [00:04:16] The correct answer is B. And I should’ve known that you explain the data in clear and simple words. Yes we’ve talked about this before and and research comparing the use of a chart with numbers and percents versus simple words. The words were proven two times more effective when communicating the market’s message and words were three times more effective at increasing purchase intent.
Doug: [00:04:39] So you got me can see the thing is is with the words the picture they’ve got to interpret it they’ve got to turn it into a thought. And if you want to get word of mouth if you want them to tell someone else about it. They’re going to have some words to do it. And so if you can just in simple terms describe what it is that’s gonna happen. You’re going to have more effective. It’s not gonna like it as much not like I like it because these are just let’s just look at the pretty picture. I don’t have to do anything and it’s just like Mind Candy going by. You know I want them to think I want them to engage. I want them to do it whether it’s emotional thinking rational thinking I don’t care but I want to touch them. You can write me poetry you can write me facts. I don’t care but I want to connect deeply.
Doug: [00:05:23] And if you’re going to connect with them and you want to get them you’re going to have to be able to articulate what it is.
Tripp: [00:05:31] Ok. All right. So you’re really in the what’s so. So let me ask you this Doug why would a graph with words is that even stronger than just words by themselves.
Doug: [00:05:42] Well sometimes we have to share data.
Tripp: [00:05:45] OK.
Doug: [00:05:46] And and so what I teach my folks is there will be no chart. Without a footer that explains it. It needs learning that we will not present a chart without a caption. And the caption captures the essence of what the thing is about. OK. All right. So that’s so we’ll do that. More more sharing data. But but so many times people will just you know leave the images and then do it and then do it. And part of it is because they don’t know what to say. So they’re not clear on it. And that gets them in trouble.
Tripp: [00:06:28] So it helps provide the clarity that you’re looking for too. From your previous message about you know being simple and as far as the message goes and being able to write to that I think you said 11th grade or 11th grader eleven year old 11 year old eleven year old.
Doug: [00:06:47] Like a fifth grade fifth or sixth grade. Okay. All right. Yeah. That that’s what you’re trying to do so. But you got to get it to words. You got to give it to words. All right. And Tripp I think that’s part of the challenge that we face is that are are you like with innovation engineering we have a communicate course.
Doug: [00:07:04] And it’s really about communicating not spelling grammar dotting i’s and crossing t’s. And that gets missed sometimes it’s not that you don’t need the writing fundamentals you do. But what we really need to get the thing that’s missing is the thinking you know so that we’ve got clarity in our thinking.
Tripp: [00:07:27] You know it’s interesting in what one of many things that are interesting about you Doug but the you know whenever I’ve met an engineer and I know quite a few that went to Purdue you know because I’m from Indiana.
Tripp: [00:07:44] But they always for people that did not either enjoy English or were very good at it. So it’s just something that you learned on your own or did you just kind of always have this or did you find out early that hey it heightened your awareness that this is the way you have to communicate. Therefore I got to become a better writer. How did you what was kind of your life
Doug: [00:08:07] What would happen to me was I I chemical engineer I worked for the Procter and Gamble the mahogany plant and then I went to brand management and I had a boss named Barb Thomas who had a Masters of Fine Arts in writing.
Tripp: [00:08:23] No.
Doug: [00:08:25] I mean I took engineering because at the least amount of writing classes and a thing you know I do the math and I never forget a week or two after I started. She called me in and she says you’re a really horrible writer.
Doug: [00:08:42] And I was like well yeah yeah I know that you hired me. And I figured I’d see my life passed before they were going to Nalco chemical in Chicago and I’m going to become a chemical salesperson. I just was I I think that was my plan. And and she says so I I don’t want you to I want you to stop writing. And I was like yes baby she says Doug not out No no no I.
Doug: [00:09:12] I read that she did the air quotes writing she says You’re never gonna write but she says you’re a very good thinker. I want you to think onto the page and changed my direction in my life. Now I’m on seven working on my eighth book of all things.
Tripp: [00:09:34] So how did that change. What was it.
Doug: [00:09:36] I just stopped trying to write. I just told my story I said with simple words and I just told it. That’s why I love Hemingway you know simple and my books people say it sounds like you’re talking to me. Doug. Yeah.
Doug: [00:09:55] Because I don’t know how to write the great American novel and it’s simple clear communication and so engineering is a powerful way and it’s very common after they go through an innovation during course. It is very common that the engineers will write concepts of score better than the marketing people.
Doug: [00:10:17] And and my best hypothesis on it is it isn’t that that they’re necessarily smarter although they’ll debate they’ve got higher IQ but they took a real degree you know which I’m not going to buy that because I graduate the bring something so I’m not in that school but I think what it is is that the product the technical people understand the product.
Doug: [00:10:40] So they make the product the hero of it or the service the hero of it. They know how the I.T. system works. They know how the system works where many times the marketing people end up using puffery because they don’t have a deep knowledge of the science of what it is the organizations doing. So it’s easier to take an engineer and get them to write things that appeal to the consumer by teaching them the rules than it is to take a marketing person and teach them physics and chemistry.
Tripp: [00:11:10] Interesting. Okay. Now that I was just curious I feel like I said a bit of people that I knew that went into engineering and they couldn’t even spell their own name. I mean it was just so sudden they weren’t interested in interesting story. Okay so the third area that we’re talking about. How many sales attempts or what do you mean.
Doug: [00:11:34] So when attempting to make a sale. Research finds that the best return on your investment of time and money is to make three attempts to make three attempts. And again we’re talking about something new. OK the first pitch you make should ignite. What the research says is curiosity.
Doug: [00:11:53] You’re not trying to really close the sale. You’re trying to get Curiosity to get them to think you want to try to get them to stop and think about here’s their problem and here’s a possible solution. Now the more weird the solution is as in the more different it is it’s going to be harder for them to grasp. So our second pitch is going to be about understanding. So curiosity the first time and understanding the second. We’re trying to get them to really understand how this thing works and how the promise made in the first pitch can be really realized. And then on the third pitch that’s what we’re going for a decision. They’ve got enough information we’re going to take care of their key concerns. And that’s where we’re going to ask for the sale.
Doug: [00:12:37] But the challenges many people make one pitch or two pitches and give up. You know don’t do this. Make three pitches to ignite the curiosity develop the understanding and get to a decision which is what you’re looking for a positive decision.
Tripp: [00:12:56] So can you kind of play this out a little bit. Let’s just let’s just take the whisk(e)y stuff that you’re working on. How you how this would apply to that particular setting if you were trying to get I don’t know you’re working with Windsor and Eaton and you know a number of different places. Well
Doug: [00:13:15] If I was if I was sign to the consumer. OK I my focus my first and foremost focus would be that everybody deserves around whisk(e)y.
Doug: [00:13:24] Ok. And I would say that now for the first time you can you can literally become a whisk(e)y maker and you can make your own bourbon And we’re going to make you the whisk(e)y maker. And the way some are able to do this is because 70 percent of the flavor comes from the wood. And what we’ve done is we’ve developed a collection of bourbons with really different woods from European cheerio to American oak to 200 year to maple cherry and smoked 3 wood smoked. And you’re able to blend these together just like the whiskey maker takes barrels from different parts of the rock house to make their whisk(e)y.
Doug: [00:14:04] Only in this case we’re going to teach you how to do this and you’re gonna make your own personal whisk(e)y.
Tripp: [00:14:11] Ok. And so was is that the Curiosity piece. Or is that.
Doug: [00:14:15] I’m gonna give the whole pitch. I’m going to give the whole pitch. But the first time around they’re going gonna be it’s a what.
Tripp: [00:14:22] Mm hmm.
Doug: [00:14:23] Then I’m going to come back down again and what I’m going to generally do with an understanding is this and sometimes this happens in the same event.
Doug: [00:14:31] You made the basic pitch. Now I’m going to take you through tasting these things. And you’re gonna get the different tastes and and then this decision.
Doug: [00:14:42] Do you want a bottle or a case.
[00:14:45] A case or 10 cases. If I go to with you one of your previous suggestions. Once they decide to buy, sell more.
Doug: [00:14:55] That’s right.
Tripp: [00:14:56] Okay.
Doug: [00:14:56] Well that’s why I want a case instead of one. Well that’s okay. It’s when you go to twelve instead of one that’s an order of magnitude you’re moving a decimal point. That’s good. We’re good on that.
Tripp: [00:15:08] Okay very good. Any other comments with regards to these three things and again when you want to be I mean the folks stop selling stop selling just.
Doug: [00:15:24] Tell your story. Tell your story. Simple words be likable and and don’t give up do it three times not because you’re trying to harass them but because you believe in your heart and soul and how valuable it is what you’re doing that you know it’s gonna make a difference for people.
Doug: [00:15:44] Funny story. And this is gonna be a public service announcement. The you. Okay so I’m old. I had just turned 60 and as you get 60 you got to do tests right. And because you got to check things it’s like the clock goes off and the doc says OK.
Doug: [00:16:05] Time for the colonoscopy. And so I go in. You’re not here yet. This is wonderful experience. Now it’s a horrific experience because it’s like a day of prep to get ready for this thing and it’s. The good news is I’m all good. MARGARET But what’s interesting about it is is you know they’re doing the chit chat. You know the nurses there who are just like it’s a production line is it running them through one or the other. And I’m just joking and saying different things and they say What do you do. I say well you know I do. You know I’ve done some books and you know I kind of invent for people. They’re like yeah whatever whatever whatever I said Yeah. And I make whisk(e)y.
Doug: [00:16:43] Oh you make whisk(e)y whisk(e)y. Yeah I do. Oh that’s really neat. Oh oh oh. And they go. That’s really nice. I mean can we get you whisk(e)y I said Well yeah. I mean you can buy it. Coming up but you know coming up you’re going to be able to you know instead of buying my whisk(e)y You know I think everybody deserves own. You can make your own bourbon. You can do what. Oh yeah. You can make your own bourbon. Really. What’s that web site again. Doctor Right.
Doug: [00:17:17] Ok. So. So we get into this next thing you know all the people the nursing station they’re all talking about this bourbon thing OK. So then I go and you do that deal you come back out. You know you’re in the recovery room or you come back to consciousness and and all of this stuff and the nurses are there.
Doug: [00:17:34] So see can we really make this better go. Yeah. In fact you can have your Christmas party if you want it over there. Oh really. Really.
Doug: [00:17:45] Would you tell the doc a doctor comes out to say you’re healthy and all the rest of this stuff. And I said By the way Doc you know I get this thing. The staff here saying and I know I have to come back in five years so I wanna make sure they’re happy with me. And all always says that’s awesome here. Call him. Call my office manager I’d love to do that. That would be great. So here I sold a Christmas party.
Tripp: [00:18:15] That’s funny.
Doug: [00:18:16] That’s right. It’s just being friendly. Telling the story I told the story multiple times. You know in a little different way each time. Nothing fancy no PowerPoint decks no anything just talking about it. Just talking about it and that’s all you got to do. And so stop selling some of the selling stuff. It’s trickery and you’re just gonna get the boomerang effect later. Now just have a simple conversation with people about what you’re going to do. And you know so this whole series is we’re closing it up now the science of innovation success. A lot of it is you know blazingly obvious but somehow we’ve lost the obviousness we’ve got too much gimmicks and tricks. If I see one more Facebook lead generation gimmick thing I’m gonna I’m just going scream. Just be folks tell people what you’re gonna do. Problem promise proof. You know some pretty basic stuff. That’s all it takes. Help me help me and I’ll be happy to give you money.
Tripp: [00:19:22] Very cool very cool. Very good. Good way to end the series.
Doug: [00:19:26] And if you want to learn more. One moment cheesy plug. I’ll learn more about the science of innovation success the innovation engineering system the innovation energy system is detailed in the new book Driving Eureka. Please support independent booksellers and of course all online conglomerates.
Tripp: [00:19:47] Good. Thank you Doug.
Doug: [00:19:49] Thank you.
Tripp: [00:19:53] Thank you for listening to the Driving Eureka! podcast. This podcast is part of the innovation Engineering Institute. Innovation engineering is a new field of academic study and leadership science. Its mission is to change the world by enabling innovation by everyone everywhere every day. resulting in increased speed and decreased risk. To learn more about on campus off campus live and online courses visit. innovation engineering dot org.